12/15/2011

Surrendering one’s right – part 3

Singaporeans must not easily surrender their rights away, or they will always be the servant to be owned by the masters. Another right that Singaporeans must not surrender and think that there is no other way out is their money in CPF.

The masters have been designing all kinds of clever schemes to retain the Singaporeans hard earned money in the CPF. Many Singaporeans have resigned to this fate that their money is now untouchable, only to feel good and smile at the monthly statements to tell them how rich they are on paper.

This is their money(minimum sum and Medisave) and must be returned. No one has the right to keep passing legislations to compulsorily take the money from its rightful owner. Get the opposition parties to fight for the return of this money. Keep hammering for it. This is your money, this is your money, and it is right that you have your money back.

Are you the master or the servant? Why should people decide to keep your money away from you and the people accept it as normal? And as long as the people LL and not say anything, the amount to be taken away will get bigger and bigger. This must be stopped.

49 comments:

Matilah_Singapura said...

Again with your fictitious rights.

If you are going to form an argument on rights, make sure that they actually exist as a legal precept first. Otherwise you're just blowing smoke out your ass.

The money in CPF is not "yours". What the fuck don't you understand about that?

People are free to believe or reject anything their government tells them.

Show me the law ie legislation which states SPECIFICALLY that the government MUST AT ALL TIMES tell the truth to the people.

Where's this law? Show me. Put up. Or shut up.

OTOH you the citizens are obliged to be truthful zt all times when making declarative statements to the government. Eg notice how you are compelled to sign a statutory declaration when dealing wkth government. Ie. You MUST, by law, under threat of prosecution and punishment, TELL THE TRUTH AT ALL TIMES when dealing with government.

Now, what's that shit about "rights" you were saying?

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

Now what kind of shit are you squeezing out of your mouth? You insist that it is not the people's right so must not be the people's right?

Just try to ask an MP or a minister to utter your nonsense that CPF is not the people's money and prove to me if anyone of them dares to say it. I am 100% sure everyone of them will tell the people it is their money not the govt's money.

Stop trying to bullshit when you are high on drugs. I say again here, the CPF money is the people's money. The govt will be bungled out of Parliament in the next election if they dare to say otherwise.

Or like you say, they can legislate it away. Just try. Now they are finding all kinds of excuses to justify holding it back, but NEVER would they claim that it is not the people's money.

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

This exactly why I need to remind the people of their rights. If they listen to you then they have no rights to anything, no right to live even as a citizen. They are not good enough, they will be shipped out and replace by FTs.

The govt does not serve the constitutions but abide by the constitution. How could you make such a silly statement? You don't serve a piece of paper called the constitution!

The govt serves the people. That is exactly why Hsien Loong is reminding his ministers that they are the servants and the people the masters, at least on paper, or on record.

Anonymous said...

Yes redbean. Tell this nitwit to stop smoking those grass.

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

Well, it's okay.

He is having a little hallucination in his little shit hole where there is no country, no govt, no laws, everyone for himself.

Matilah_Singapura said...

Wah. Temper temper. Just because something is said or people agree (like religion) doesn't make it TRUE in F A C T.

If you cannot control the money, that means it is not yours. What don't you understand about that?

Hey, I know you want to come off as some kind of "people's knight " by defending so-called "rights " you can only CLAIM but cannot PROVE.. but hey, it's your life.. do WTF you like!

Summing up:

Just because something is CLAIMED - usually with passion and attitude - doesn't make it true.

BTW I'm indifferent to outcomes of election s. So if there's blood on the streets in 2016,so be it. I'm of the persuasion that more societies collase FROM WITHIN rather than get conquered by invaders.

So redbean: where is this law that the government is obliged to tell the truth?

Anon: fuck your mother with a rusty fork. I hear she loves it.

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

So redbean: where is this law that the government is obliged to tell the truth?

I didn't make this statement and neither do I believe in it. You hearing voices? : )

Anonymous said...

For some unknown reasons, I always have the strange feeling that our Gov only provides Half Truth NOT the Whole Truth to suit their brainwashing of Singaporeans.

Anonymous said...

I AGREE with you totally. CPF money belongs to us , the people. It is not right to keep raising the bar ever so often that no one gets to it other than to let some ( you know who ) squander it away in the name of soverign wealth funds. We are the carrots that have been chopped at the expense of the peoples' hard earned money. I cannot undertand why the CPF is never discussed during eletions ??? are the 60% of the population so dumb and numb ????

Anonymous said...

Can we expect something like this sooon ??


http://imcmsimages.mediacorp.sg/cmsfileserver/showimageCC.aspx?450&378&f=2232&img=2232_539154.jpg

Anonymous said...

The garmen only says in words that all the money is ours but in fact, in action, they do the opposite, they treat our money as if it is all theirs.

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

The key is what can you do about it or what are you going to do about it? If the people accepts it as the normal, they have to live with it as the normal. But they don't have to accept it and can vote in another party that stands for returning the money to the people.

The sum held back is no small change, and growing. And like all bubbles, it will burst when it gets too big, sooner or later.
This is a scientific as well as social law.

Matilah_Singapura said...

By stating (along similar lines) that the masters are designing plans re: CPF... I assume that you're implying that the government is engaging in deceitful practices. I have no issue with that -- all governments LIE at sometime for whatever reason.

Following the reasoning :therfore it would follow that the government should tell the truth. Yes? NO? Maybe I hear voices. No matter.

"Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under" -- Mencken

For those who claim "CPF MONEY BELONGS TO US" please provide PROOF to backup your claim.

I'll bet you can't do it. However I can (and have several times.. Even redbean thru gritted teeth will stubbornly agree) that cpf is

1. A tax. Therefore SUNKEN COST (cannot recover)

2. A clever scheme -- essentially a tax funded Ponzi Scheme where funds are CO MINGLED with each other and "ownership " is an elaborate con game where the confidence people issue monthly "statements".. which are in fact well-engineered BULLSHIT.

When it comes to well-engineered bullshit, the government is only eclipsed by one other: religion.

Anonymous said...

There is an indirect way to proof this CPF has physical presence and is not a real mirage. If one decides to one day become a "Quitter" ( famous word coined by some old geezer)and reliquish his citizenship , CPF can be withdrawn in full. Many have done it ... so , may I ask : why reward quitters by paying them what is due to every tax paying singaporean in the first place? I am sure you see the irony , no ?

Matilah_Singapura said...

@redbean 1141: what to do?

Speaking for myself -- all action is personal and individual.

1. Forget about sunken costs. Grab and learn what you can

2. Use whatever mechanism is there to "recover" as much value from your so-called money in CPF. ACT SWIFTLY and don't tell anyone!!

3. You are caught in a Ponzi pool... don't do anything to spook the herd because if the herd goes nuts, the government will just pass another law.. and everyone GETS SCREWED!!

4. Have big dreams and big plans so as not to allow anything the government does or doesn't do to affect your life in any significant way.

5. Limit the realms where you need to rely on government to provide "security ".

6. Whatever happens, get the fuck on with your life, as everyone is mortal.

7. Governments, cuntries, borders are all becoming LESS SIGNIFICANT.

8. Always act in your own SELF INTEREST. People who tell you otherwise are acting in THEIR self interest and are attempting to MANIPULATE you.

9. Form vast (social) networks -- go beyond your own spheres of influence / expertise.

10. Have lots of sex

Matilah_Singapura said...

Anon1202

No, quitting and collecting "your CPF" proves nothing. Here's how I'll falsify your hypothesis :

1. The number of quitters will always be LESS than the numbers of stayers.

2. Therefore the Tax funded Ponzi Scheme can continue because there'll always be enough to cover the quitters.

3. Many quitters are young nowadays. So "their" CPF accounts won't be very much.. easily covered by the working serfs.

4. To test your claim, there has to be a RUN on te CPF by massive collective coordinated quitting. Say, one shot 50,000 (pulling numbers out my arse) Sporeans QUIT and DEMAND their money.

5. My theory is that the government will interdict. This will be proof positive that cpf money belongs to and is CONTRLLED BY the government

Matilah_Singapura said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

I must say , for a person who hardly responds on other peoples' blogs. What red bean has written resonates strongly with me and I am sure with many. Nice work with your photos.

As for "Matila_S" , enjoy your comments very much. "hard knocks" are hard to swallow but good for waking up most in slumber land ... many under the spells of pay and pay have indeed become a model "sinkie"

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

I thought I was the one provking everyone, Matilah beats me to it this morning. Let me make some general comments. But first, Matilah, don't get the disease of demanding people to prove something like one is a thief and demanding evidence. So easy to get evidence meh?

Anon 12:02 has given a good example of how to take back the cpf money. The bank run example is a bad example as the same run on a bank will end up the same way.

And welcome anon 12:38. Glad you like photo.

Okay, what I am going to say is that the system is designed for the average Sinkies to treat this place as a temporary abode. When the time comes, in order to benefit from the system, they must be quitters, sell the HDB flats, take out all the cpf and vamose. Any average sinkie that chooses to stay behind will end up with nothing.

This temporary abode concept also applies to the rich and famous. Enjoy when things are good and flee when things turn back. The quitters will always be replaced by hungrier mobs who can benefit from the system from a lower base.

The system is only for a small group of elite whose lives are made for generations without having to work, living on their inflated assets, savings and pensions. The system will take care of them forever.

Anonymous said...

Redbean , thanks for comments above. you give a classic desription of a Ponzi scheme which has been around since time immemorial. If only more sinkies realise this.... but do sinkies have the wisdom and curage to deal with this very tricky human condition ?? I share "mati_"'s way of dealing with it ... we must help ourselves first !

Anonymous said...

If CPF is the your money, why is it called Central Provident Fund and not Citizen's Pension Fund? The name itself already tells you the money does not belong to you but to the government.

If every citizen is claiming CPF is their money, the employers can also claim CPF is their money too as they also contributed a small portion of their money to their employee's CPF every month.

CPF by itself is a tax to both the employers and the people. To the employers, it is a sort of corporate tax. To the people, CPF is another type of income tax. Why do you think the employer's portion of CPF contribution is reduced every time there is recession while the people's portion of CPF contribution stays the same?

Anonymous said...

Above, your point is cogent and clear. Why not let PAP come out with this and state it once and for all and wake all sinkies up ?? 2016 .... got balls to say this or not ???

Anonymous said...

Whatever the govt is going to say or claim, the average sinkies must not, never, say that this is not their money. Once they accepted such a position, it is gone forever.

We all know what it is and we must cling on to it and pray for a new party to stand up for the people to return the money to the people. The day will come.

Anonymous said...

wake up SINKIES !! the CPF money belongs to the people. WAAAAKE UPPPP

Matilah_Singapura said...

@anon 115
@redbean:

Demanding evidence and verifying that evidence when presented is the only way to get closer to the truth. This is the basis for intellectual rigour, and in fact is supposed to be the way the legal system works: hard evidence, just the facts ma'am...and the "null hypothesis" assumed as the default position when evaluating a claim.

e.g. Claim: I put my wallet here. You were here. My wallet is gone.

Therefore YOU STOLE MY WALLET. (hypothesis)

Null hypothesis: You DID NOT steal my wallet.

We assume the null hypothesis unless there is POSITIVE VERIFIABLE EVIDENCE to support the original claim.

> But first, Matilah, don't get the disease of demanding people to prove something like one is a thief and demanding evidence. So easy to get evidence meh? <

Changing the language relating a demand for evidence into a "disease" is yet another way of dodging the real issue.

No, sometimes evidence is very difficult to obtain. Sometimes you can't get any at all. That doesn't negate the FACT that the only way you can get closer to the truth is by hard, positive, verifiable evidence.

...otherwise you are speculating/ guessing. Try speculating and guessing when accusing someone of a crime. Now you see the importance/ necessity of hard evidence when making a serious claim.

===
S.pore govt got plenty smart people. MBA, PhD, kam lanchiau lah..all sorts of "intimidating" paper qualifications.

Therefore, the best way to fight these motherfuckers is to get your own intellectual toolbox together beginning with healthy active skepticism and the demand for evidence for ANY CLAIM you encounter. Learn how to think critically and to spot logical fallacies beginning with your own claims/ statements.
====

@ redbean:

I do not disagree with redbean's claim that the system is designed for a "temporary abode". In fact it makes sense -- everyone has to die sometime. The luckier ones might get the opportunity to emigrate, and then die :-)

Whatever the case, yes, the system is the best "compromise" as long as people agree to the con, and not demand "truth" or "change" from a system built on BULLSHIT and HOPE from the bottom up.

Anonymous said...

There was a time , retirees could take out CPF ... now , CPF ... what CPF ?? And transfer of CPF to next of kin upon death is just "roll-over" ... the generation will be robbed of it eventually.

I am sure sinkies are not daft ... probably just choose to accept whatever is given .... sad state ... easy sheep for slaughter

Matilah_Singapura said...

USA example, but applicable to Singapore. Brother George Carlin testifyin'. I've re titled the piece. Creative License...on my part ;-)

Dreamers in Dot Paradise

Anonymous said...

5 Stars !! Marrrrtilahhhh ... nice one . Sinkies ... help yourselves to it ... and wake up at their ( you know who) peril...

Matilah_Singapura said...

redbean shares his doubts about CPF.

I hate Matilah

Remember:

CPF == Pyramid/Ponzi Scheme

Perpetual Funding == Legalised theft/ extortion. Compulsory (under threat of prosecution) "contribution" by employer AND employee.

Fabricated "evidence" of ownership == online/ periodic statements of "ownership". Bullshit idea of "ownership" reinforced by emigres who relinquish S'pore citizenship, and receive "their" CPF in total.
For citizens: Compulsory Medicare contribution. Compulsory minimum sum you cannot touch, but looks nice on the statement :-)

Logical contradictions == how can you claim OWNERSHIP if you do not have TOTAL CONTROL on what is supposedly yours?

Positive, independently verifiable EVIDENCE == to this date no one has achieved this standard of intellectual rigour to prove the "rightful ownership" of CPF monies.

Bullshit. CPF is a TAX, funding a perpetual legalised and compulsory pyramid scheme. Since it is a tax, it is sunken cost.

Forget it. Grab what you can, then enjoy your life.

Anonymous said...

Turn self-employed ... less "Tax" ?

Anonymous said...

One owns only what is in his/her control. Whatever one owns but is in the control of others, it is as most netizens liken to, Ponzi Scheme. To me, it is more like ransom.

"Get the opposition parties to fight for the return of this money", unquote.
Not a good suggestion in my view, the Alternative Party Politicians should have been more pro-active than You(Chin Leng). They SHOULD HAVE INITIATED a campaign on the CPF Issue since a decade ago. Alas! None did and none is interested much in it.

60% have found living condition in Sin to be fine and given their votes to the Incumbent. These voters may not have issue with any policy yet and maybe for some decades to come.

Chin Leng happens to be the ONLY BLOGGER that has tirelessly blogged on CPF, Housing and Cultural Matters. With just a handful of participants here, me does not see much fruitful result coming from his laudable effort. I AM MORE INCLINE TO BELIEVE THAT SINGAPOREANS WILL CHOOSE TO REMAIN DAFT than to seek justice from the Government.

Matilah wrote, quote: "so if there's blood on the streets in 2016,so be it. I'm of the persuasion that more societies collase FROM WITHIN rather than get conquered by invaders", unquote.

Indeed, me feels that greed and hence corruption and abuse of power
are the main causes of downfall of most regimes. History is full of such evidence.

patriot

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

Hi patriot, many bloggers choose to read rather than post. At its peak, the daily page view in this blog is 3000+. Now it is about half which is still 1,500.

So it is not just a few bloggers here. The readership is much bigger.

Matilah_Singapura said...

Getting a political solutions to this CPF issue is doomed to failure.

Again, an unproven claim, and lots of "wishful thinking " ie: PAP=bad, alternative (socialist / communist party) =good.

BULLSHIT. There is no reason to believe that an alternative party will bring a workable solution - especially if they're left-leaning socialist.

Since Spore is a constitutional republic, it is governed and run by THE RULE OF LAW.

Therefore the BEST CHANCE OF SUCCESS is to challenge CPF in the law courts. The law courts are the proper place to determine ISSUES RELATING TO OWNERSHIP. ie Courts specialise in solving conflicts over who-owns-what. This is a matter of PROPERTY.

So fuck you stupid arseholes who make insane claims (which you can't prove) on solving CPF issues by the ballot.

Are you motherfuckers crazy as well as dumb?

I think so. (but I can't prove it)

Anonymous said...

master-de-bater, what rule of law and changing the constitution? The law was never independent in the first place.

Anonymous said...

Well, it is a well-known fact that social political bloggers are individualistic in doing their blogging. You know, me knows and so is the Authority; that is the reason why the Government never got interested in the cyber-activists. Most in Blogoland know that few bloggers have the staying power nor are they able to relate to each other.

As for seeking justice using the Legal System in Sin, Singaporeans are mostly aware of who write the Laws and have the power to change it. BUT, who will uphold and provide justice? AND IT IS SIMPLY RIDICULOUS FOR CITIZENS TO HAVE TO SEEK JUSTICE FROM THEIR RULERS!

patriot

Anonymous said...

Short & Simple solution:
Just keep voting wisely in GE 2016.

Why did 60% vote the way they did?

See Straits Times, 16 Dec 2011. The page is A21.
Page is called "Review & Forum".
Article #1 is called "The Perils of Wilful Blindness"
Article #2 is called "Lessons in Cogntive Bias From the Day of Infamy".

Anonymous said...

Matilah_S , obviously talking out of your arse. Challenge the CPF issue in the law courts ?? You are obviously dumb. This is a direct challenge to our constitutional law , ever heard of ISA ? go feck yourself

Matilah_Singapura said...

I'm glad people are running out of arguments they resort to ad hominem like asking me to fuck myself.

That mother fucked pork fat greasy asshole anon 831 can't even spell "fuck" probably because of the brain damage caused by sucking milk from his drug addict crack whore mother... Anyway, I digress... Back to the matter at hand.

Voting in another asshole and potentially CORRUPT bunch of politicians from the so-called "opposition parties" is no solution, especially when the lot of them are UNIMPRESSIVE and as pretentious as the incumbent PAP -- ie none of the opposition can back up any of their UNPROVEN CLAIMS with any evidence.

I don't apologise for being a skeptic.

Perhaps I should apply the same skepticism to the Singapore justice system -- the courts where matters of conflict are ultimately settled.

My point is that the courts are the only place you can settle matters of property dispute, and CPF is property dispute ie is the money REALLY YOURS.. or not? SIMPLE ANSWER: YES or NO

Don't trust the courts? Then fix it. Can't or won't fix (supposedly) broken justice system.. the you are FUCKED, all of you. Just bend over and learn to enjoy your anus being continually raped by a brutal master.

Get infected by the Stockholm Syndrome and become emotionally attached as a victim to your oppressors. And I will be amused by your performance as an entertainer!! :-))

Matilah_Singapura said...

wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome

Anonymous said...

Feck you Matila.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feck

Anonymous said...

Another one for you Matilah _S , you pseudo-cultured fecking moron :

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=feck

Anonymous said...

Another one for you Matilah _S , you pseudo-cultured fecking moron :

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=feck

Anonymous said...

RD,why delete other comment? Cannot handle the pressure? Then F off pls. What that comment you had deleted??

Anonymous said...

15 Dec ,1245pm post?

Anonymous said...

RD dating your mother again? go fuck off lah you doggie.

Matilah_Singapura said...

@anons 1000 and 1007

Wow are you mother feckers Irish?

I don't think so, but you neednt be. I'm not Chinese but I can make references to the state of your mum's/ mums' putrid genitalia in Hokkein, to wit:

Kani nabu chow chee bye!

Feck you too :-)

Anonymous said...

merely pointing out to you there are other ways of saying the F word. You phuck wit Martilah-S. By the way , is that your best in using hokkien swear words? sad.... you need to climb back to where you came from... and you know where that is , you sad fuck.

Matilah_Singapura said...

@ anon 506

Here you are in Hindi

teri madhti pudhti

How my multi linguistics? Boleh tahan yah?

Regards to you mum. Tell her to use soap and to wipe from front to back :-)

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