6/22/2012
Ah Kong kenna fined for protecting his family
My hero, Ong Long Hock, broke the jaw of a gangster and was fined $3000. He could have been jailed if not for his age and for self defense.
The gangsters, three of them, harassed his daughter in law, whacked his son and he as well when he tried to protect his son. They ran when the daughter in law called the police. Luckily or unluckily, Ah Kong and son caught one of them and that’s when Ah Kong gave the gangster a broken jaw.
Then the law took over. The law is the law. And Sinkie law is the most civilized and kind of all laws against gangsters. When gangsters beat you up, you must be careful not to hurt the gangsters in self defense. Ah Kong forgot, and in the heat of the moment, after being beaten by the gangsters, and seeing his son being beaten, gave it to the gangster. For beating the gangster, Ah Kong kenna fined $3000. Well done, prosecutor. You have done your job well. Justice is blind. The symbol of blind justice is on the front façade of the court.
The gangster has yet to be charged and his two accomplices are still at large. But they need not worry. The law will be kind to them. Poor Ah Kong, kenna hit still want to hit back. Didn’t know how civilized our laws are. Cannot anyhow hit people lah, even if they are gangsters who hit you!
By the way, if I were in the Ah Kong’s place, I would not break the gangster’s jaw. I would break both his hands and legs as well. And let the court sentence me to jail, for justice to prevail. The law is the law. The law is to protect the citizens from harm, including gangsters and provocateurs.
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141 comments:
An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth and a jaw for a jaw
Cannot. We are a rule of law country. Let the law to punish those who beat you. Cannot take the law into your own hands. Singaporeans must be law abiding citizens.
So if You "beat" the judges the judges can punish you? if retaliation is against the law, the law gods should practice what they preach and not retaliate when retaliated. No?
Ah Kong should claimed it is self defence and not aggression. Law is ok for those who defence themselves against hurt.
Someone harass your daughters private parts, your wife's private parts...your grandfather, grandmother, mother,father private parts and even provoke you to a fight and you just stand there...gong gong, smile, turn your other cheek and say...god bless you is it?
Next time, you go beat up a policeman, the policeman will be bound by the rule of law and not retaliate lol
/// An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth and a jaw for a jaw
June 22, 2012 9:10 AM ///
As Mahatma Gandhi would say: An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
/// An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth and a jaw for a jaw
June 22, 2012 9:10 AM ///
As Mahatma Gandhi would say: An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
In Sing ah, if got people beat you, you must call police and wait for police to come. Cannot fight back one. And when police come, check you ok or not ok. If injury not serious, tell you to sue the attacker. Only if injury serious, end up in hospital, then police will look for the attacker.
Well, when you point a finger gun at the police head, make sure the policeman doesn't point a real gun to your head lol
So the law enforcers can beat you for beating them up but the reverse not true yah?
what if woffles wu had beaten the gangster? He would have been given a national day award
"As Mahatma Gandhi would say: An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."
Ghadhi wisdom should apply to the court of justice then
PAP's law only target male non-elite Singaporeans la. Even if those gangster sodomize our hero Ah Kong, I bet our corrupt judge and AG will still penalize the old hero if he fight back.
Merely 8 years after LHL, EVERY branch of government are utterly corrupted.
Anonymous said...
Ah Kong should claimed it is self defence and not aggression. Law is ok for those who defence themselves against hurt.
June 22, 2012 9:30 AM
There is a fine line between self defense and aggression.
in malaysia, if the public catch a criminal for doing a crime (robbery, molest, etc) they beat him up. even when police arrive they continue beating him up. police just haul the criminal to police station. no action taken against the people who whack. in police station kena whack some more by the police. plenty of videos on youtube. i'm a s'porean. our govt really castrate the people.
In Malaysia, criminals are criminals and must be treated like criminals. In Sing, criminals are humans and have rights to be protected. Just like in this case, Ah Kong beat up a criminal and kena fined because Ah Kong forgot criminals have rights too.
In Sing, innocent people can be turned into criminals when provoked or beaten by criminals. Uniquely Singapore. And kena fined some more. Great justice. Justice is blind, true, true.
When someon punish you, the law says you shouldn't punish back because the law will punish on your behalf.
While you wait for the law to retaliate against your punisher, I hope your eyes,face and limps are still intact after your punisher is done with you. haaaa
Hi Lah Chiau, welcome to the blog.
Woffles got fined $1000 for making false reports. This Ah Kong got fined $3000 for defending his family.
What is happening?
Anon 10:08, agree with you. This is sick, very sick. Now Ah Kong will be more angry with the govt than with the gangsters.
If I am Ah Kong,I will LL pay the fine.Who will believe me if I claim that I am using minimum force to defend my family?
I am poor,not influential,have connection but dun believe in taking advantage of the system.Whatever charges pressed against me,I will have to plead for leniency hoping for a lesser fine and forget the case.
I cannot afford a lawyer and being fine more for wasting their time.
3 K means a lot to me but 5 K also LL got to pay.
Dun get into more trouble by saying there is no justice,they got no brain etc...My blood pressure goes up when you talk about justice.
What can I say?
Sorry..your RIGHT to retaliate. If the rule of law disagrees with that....then make sure they, the rulers, practice what it preaches and not use the rule of law for....violence against the people
I also agree with you. The judge was right. He was upholding the law and applied the law as it is. This is our law. Cannot say there is no justice. The gangsters will face their justice when caught, just like Ah Kong facing his justice.
Ah Kong is still my hero. I will do the same as him. And I think many Sinkies will do the same. It is basic instinct to protect one's family when they are in danger, or being beaten.
And I thought this is the right of every innocent citizen. No?
This stupid rule of law, citizens must not resort to violence when being bullied, is designed(the principle be behind the law of non retaliation) to turn citizens into cowards/passive/docile against their dictators or the dictators can do as they please while the people wait for the next election to peacefully protest mah
Ah Kong was fined $3000 and his lawyer fee was many more $1000s.
Ah Kong damn gong(silly), after he got bullied by gangster he got to pay lawyer for doing what? And then further fined by the Rule By Law some more.
I concurs with Agongkia.
This Ah Kong got fined $3000 for defending his family.
This Ah Kong got fined $3000 for defending his family.
This Ah Kong got fined $3000 for defending his family.
"This Ah Kong got fined $3000. What is happening?". "Now Ah Kong will be more angry with the govt than with the gangsters". Unquote. Yah, what is happening? And what can Ah Kong do?
patriot
Guaranteed, Matilah_Singapura will say Ah Kong deserved to be fined.
The people must back ah kong lah
The right to fukking retaliate when idiots threaten YOUR RIGHT TO PEACE
It is a sick comedy.
It is a sick country.
Maybe this is the reason why foreigners like to beat up the locals. They know the locals cannot hit back or they will be charged in court.
Nothing to do with the cuntry lah. It is the fuckers in the cuntry screwing the people.
Must blame the right people mah, otherwise it is like blaming Ah Kong for protecting his family, right?
Ah Kong fantastic leh, he can fighted young men and injured them somemore hor.
Whatever the government does to you, you cannot hit back or protest......same same
Sinkies.
Better vote Opposition if you want to protect your children and parents.
The Pretend Action Party is just that.
Pretend only.
"Stand Up for Singapore"
The Singapore they want you to stand up for is not people.
It's all the expensive properties belonging to all the elites.
He is a hero, he got gut to protect his family. But nobody protected him and he got fined. Poor Ah Kong!
Now is the time for the people to speak in defense of ah kong but, who cares right?
i still cannot get over it.
woffles rich bastard bluff police,
lie to the law,
fucking coward,
get old ah kong to take the rap for him twice and 6 YEARS later after the crime then kena punish.
n punishment is $1k fine.
people not happy
somemore got minister for law defend him, somemore attorney general chambers work on SUNDAY to defend him.
old ah kong act in self defense for daughter-in-law against gangster molester kena fine $3k. knnbccb!
by the way this woffles face & head look like cock head cannot pull back the foreskin one.
@patriot.
Thanks for reading.
It appear to me that Ah Kong will only be fined S1,000 maximum if he did not get a lawyer for such case.
But one can always argue that Ah Kong is the aggressor and cause grievous hurt in order to secure a case.They will suggest that after he managed to detain one of them,he should call the police and wait for the police to arrive which take dun know how long.Expect AH Kong to know how to arm lock and risk being assaulted if the detainee try to escape if he want to detain him for the Authority.
Never mind,Ah Kong got money.
If me,I said before ,any charges on me whether I right or wrong,I can only LL PG and hope for the least fine.
Ah kong is not the aggressor lah though he got aggressive.
We need to teach people not to provoke others if they don't won't their jaws broken and not the other way round where provocateurs can go round breaking peaceful people jaws hoping not to be caught.
correct error.....is...don't want...
Will people wake up and challenge this stupid rule of law?
Ah Kong < 80 yrs old?
Sigh...Ah Kong should've know that there are bigger "gangsters"
Only an idiot would think it is right to charge Ah Kong.
Would the gangsters have beaten ah Kong and his family if they knew ah Kong has the right to break their jaws?
I think if gangsters or illed behaved think innocent people cannot fight back because the rule of law tied their hands or fists, they will go round behaving dangerously.
We need to correct this mistake so people will think twice about ruffling innocent people's feathers
Take the recent incident at the mrt when an old lady fucked a young lady after she gave up her seat to her.
People generally cited with the young lady for fucking the old lady back (no fist fight though).
The Americans are more sensible and practical people. The right to self defense is sacrosant to them. And they knew the crooks are armed and therefore allowed citizens to be armed, to shoot back.
Only misled daft Sinkies would wait for the police to come when attacked. By then they would be dead or become minced meat. But they would assure you that they will apprehend the bad guys. In the meantime the daft Sinkie would be in the hospital bed and had to pay the hospital bills.
The don't call Sinkies daft for nothing. It is legendary.
Anyone here or anywhere dare to kee chiu, please to so and invite us to your home because we would like to fuck you
Yeah
The country is quite sick isn't it?
What the police and AG office are impressing upon the public is to quietly and submissively endure the beatings by bullies and gangsters.
After that, if you are not dead yet or half paralysed. Call the police to and have them charged in court......if and when the police are able to identify and catch your assailants ....AND also wait and see if the police decide whether you need a magistrate order first!
This is a sick country. It seems we can't protect ourselves while being bullied and beaten. And when we bring it upon overselves to try stop the assault and apprehend these violent perpetrators. We are not suppose lift a finger against them.
Strange country this Singapore.
Really strange.
I wonder and seriously wonder; what would the PROSECUTOR and the JUDGE do, if they were faced with the same problem as Ah Kong Ong Long Hock had faced, that is family members got abused by three men?
Any answer?
And I thank Agongkia for his response.
patriot
The Christian says...turn the other cheek and bless your enemies.
So enough of them becoming influential, such as Christian judges, they will impose their religious way of resolving disputes or when attacked.
Hallelujah
That's why I say....these lawyers and judges...study so much law...go oxfart cum back...also no different from another farter...any time, ordinary people never go oxfart also think better than them
In fact, the most violent people during peace time are those behind the hammer/law.
They can LITERALLY kill you with their words
read the fine print before you comment. typical of redbean. jumping to conclusions before getting the facts right about ah gong. spinning half truths misleading others.
ah gong was not fined because he defended his daughter. anybody would do the same. ah gong was fined because he and another person had already pinned the guy on the ground and he continued beating him up until he broke the guy's jaws. so called vigilante justice. we shd not allow that.
To set a precedent in rol - just in case some one else breaks the jaw of a MIW
I believe in the right to retaliate when the person or persons have shown aggression. However, I will stop at...an eye for an eye or a tooth for a tooth.
If the gangsters have not broken any of ah kong loved one's jaws or his jaws, he should stop at the measures he was dealt with.
Another daft Sinkie trying to split pubic hair. After raping the woman, the rapist lighted a cigarette to have a puff. When he was not looking, the victim took a bottle and smashed his head, killing him.
Rape victim sentenced to death for killing rapist. Reason, raping was over. Victim cannot hit back at rapist with bottle, knowing or not knowing it would kill him.
Sinkie line of thought.
If MIWs policies have caused lives, how should they be dealt with?
I think the woman raped has the right to castrate the rapist
An eye for an eye, do you call that vigilante justice?
JeffGoh said...
To set a precedent in rol - just in case some one else breaks the jaw of a MIW
June 22, 2012 2:23 PM
Precise. The law is designed to protect those in power
Preciselee
The beating up of the gangster by Ah Kong was part of a process that his daughter in law was harassed, his son and himself were beaten. At that moment you can imagine how furious Ah Kong and son were.
And when they caught one of them, he let the gangster had it, he would not know it could break his jaw. He just let go on him. If he got a knife, he would use it.
Not everyone can hold his temper like the immortals, like cool cucumber.
Or shall the whole incident be broken up into Act I Scene I, Act 2 Scene 2, Act 3 Scene 3, all unrelated events? Act 1 can do this, Act 2 cannot do that, Act 3 must cool down?
Keep it simple. A broken jaw for a broken jaw. Be angry but you can still stop at killing someone or causing irreversible damages. But if you have lost control, then too bad.
Justice?
The Prosecutor and the Judge were
enforcing Laws. NOT JUSTICE.
Sinkies don't understand Law lah, oni talk no sense.
Who created the laws? Stupid laws?
Actually, when you fought back, it is difficult to ascertain the damages similarly, the gangsters could have broken the victims bones.
Want to fine the old man....fine him a $1
Sinkies no understand justice. Sinkies know money. Money many many very good.
What is justice? Whose justice?
Scary to think that there are people who actually think only a handfool of people understand justice
80+ comments on ah kong topic. that's quite a record, redbean. it goes to show most of your readers are ah kongs (including me). old but gold.
Next time, you killed some people in the name of defending your country in your green uniform, you can also be charged for murder. So think carefully.
Hi Anon 3:48, I think there are quite a number of grandpas here, but also many young ones as well.
Matilah is only 18: )
Cheers.
Passion and anger can and usually lead to loss of control, however, it seems that professional people are very sane even when provoke. Or, I believe, some professionals are ignorant of such emotion.
patriot
Is not that they are ignorant. their natural anger has been suppressed so they appeared cool or cold and inhuman. In fact, the higher you are in the corporate world, the colder or more hypocritical.
An eye for an eye.
Does it matter if there legalised and nonlegalised mafia and gangster as they are still gangster and mafia that need to be protected ?
On the other hand,
Guess which old fart say this.
"Put it this way. As long as Jeyaretnam [Workers' Party leader] stands for what he stands for -- a thoroughly destructive force for me -- we will knock him. There are two ways of playing this. One, a you attack the policies; two, you attack the system. Jeyaretnam was attacking the system, he brought the Chief Justice into it. If I want to fix you, do I need the Chief Justice to fix you? Everybody knows that in my bag I have a hatchet, and a very sharp one. You take me on, I take my hatchet, we meet in the cul-de-sac. That's the way I had to survive in the past. That's the way the communists tackled me. He brought the Chief Justice into the political arena. He brought my only friend in university into our quarrel. How dare he!"
Pity the Ah Kong. But too bad Ah Kong like the rest of us don't belong to the Inner Circle of Elites/Foreigners. Else Ah Kong would have just been fined $1000 for breaking that gangster's jaw - and the gangster would be made to say thank you to Ah Kong for teaching him a lesson.
Besides paying 3 K,Ah Kong now has something extra.
Criminal record for assault.
Become popular in Kopi tiam now.
Lets hope that his daughter in law and son will repay him by being more filial.
And not forgetting that because of this incident ,he is lucky to have 80 over readers here calling him Ah Kong,including Mr Bean.
When can I have so many people calling me Ah Kong overnight?
ah kong should be happy now even if he kena pay $3k fine. he became a hero. he gets to break a gangster's jaw. he became famous. he has exposed the wickedness of our justice system. he is giving hope to all other ah kongs that they too might have the strength to break other people's jaws. i think next few days, strangers will raise money to reimburse him for his fine and lawyer's fee, not that i think he needs it. just for the sake of solidarity. and he now knows some ah mas are dreaming of him.
Ah Kong is protecting his family so why fine him for protecting his family ?
Don't one of the gangsters at large attacks him and send him to the hospital. They are out there.
@anon 1037:
>> Guaranteed, Matilah_Singapura will say Ah Kong deserved to be fined. <<
Are you nuts? I am a gun-rights advocate and a licensed weapons owner.
I have consistently defended the right to use violence for self defense, which include defending your home and family.
It seems you must be careful with the wording and the "intent".
If you say "retaliate", then the law will fuck you up.
Instead your intention must be, and you must state "self defense", which means it must occur immediately during the time you are attacked.
If you chase after the fucker and hantam him -- or god forbid you shoot him -- then you are going to kena screwed by the law.
I have a good friend who works at the women's prisons. Many women there are serving time for murder. They were consistently physically and sexually abused by their male partners, to the point they couldn't take it anymore, they killed their aggressors. Law is very clear: once you have intent on retaliation or reprisal, you are GUILTY OF A UNLAWFUL ACT, and off to jail with you.
Lucky Ah Kong didn't pick up an object to hammer/ stab the gangster -- even if the gangster deserved it. If he did, they'd have throw the book at him. Perhaps even luckier still, he's in Singapore. In any other place, the gangster could have pulled out a weapon and our hero Ah Kong would be another fatal crime statistic.
So learn how to defend yourselves, and strike hard and fast in "the right areas" when the action is happening -- then you are within the definition of "self defense". Women especially -- learning to defend yourself is a good idea.
redbean is right: The law is the law. BUT it is sad that he, at his age and supposedly level of wisdom, can't even interpret it correctly. To make matters even worse, he hands out "advice" that is likely to land well-meaning people in jail.
On his part, he is highly irresponsible.
redbean needs to go back to some sort of school to learn the definition and meaning of "self defense". But I doubt he will. Redbean would much live a society where punching people who make fun of you is not only condoned, but celebrated.
Anyway, for the other reader's, here's my 2 cents:
Physically striking someone who is insulting you IS NOT "self defense".
Chasing after the person who has harmed you or your family and beating him down is not "self defense".
Striking someone in the windpipe, breaking it and killing him after that person has molested your daughter is not "self defense".
Striking someone in the windpipe, breaking it and killing him when he is holding you at the point of a weapon and demanding your money, IS DEFINITELY self defense. (i.e. "your money or your life" -- implicitly or explicitly expressed).
Seeking out, finding him then striking the robber in the windpipe, breaking it and killing him AFTER he held you up last night, is murder and thus not "self defense".
"So learn how to defend yourselves, and strike hard and fast in "the right areas" when the action is happening -- then you are within the definition of "self defense". Women especially -- learning to defend yourself is a good idea."
No lawyer here but please go check the meaning of retaliation before you shit here. Base on your quote, you struck back and that falls within the definition of retaliation - return kind for kind or an eye for an eye.
Self defense is more like...run for your life and may not involve...retaliation. You carry weapons (lol), you may kill someone and it rubbish all that you said here about self defense.
That said, retaliation IS NOT vengeance. One may have to counter strike to subdue your attacker. You may have to hit your attacker so hard that he/she backs off or stop the attack but without killing the person.
That's all part of self defense AND retaliation.
anon 7.45 talking rot. matilah brain is at peak performance at 2am in d morning.
I can only conclude that singapore's law is bias. If you are rich and have connections you can get away easily. Who controls the judges and courts anyway? Another case of INjustice INequality INsingapore. Poor ah kong. Now gangster also pappy friends, maybe pappy hope gangsters will tote for them come 2016.
No he will make the gangster more handsome and save $3,000.
What Christian thinking? Dont side track hor
Got nothing better to say is it? Why this matilah mati mati must attack redbean. Got some hidden agenda huh? If matilah doesnt like what redbean wrote then dont read lah.
Thank you Matilah for the thoughtful explanation of what constitutes self defense and what not. The law is the law even if it is screwed up law. Remember that.
The law does not take into account the emotions, tensions, pressure, stress, fear and psychological changes at the moment when one is being attacked, beaten, or when one is so provoked when family members are hurt. The human instinct takes over.
Under those circumstances, one does not have the time to sip a cup of tea, take a puff, and think of what can be done or cannot be done according to the law, if he even knows what is the law. An emotionally charged person, in a threatened situation, as a victim, would not think like a person having a cup of tea and reading his newspaper.
In the heat of the moment, anything goes. But the law is so sane,cool, innocent and perfect in the comfort of a court room, and will deal with the person according to the law. The law is the law, justice can be perverted to serve the law.
No need Lawyer, prosecutor, judge and even policeman if we go by the ideal. All we need is sensibility. As sensibility does not prevails all the time, the commonsense has to come in. Me likes to say that a very experienced psychologist is needed to be in our court of justice to guide our prosecutor and judge before they proceed with their charge, conviction and sentencing of 'offenders'.
I would say that under the Said Circumstances as described, Ah Kong OR ANYONE ELSE FOR THE MATTER WOULD HAVE REACTED MUCH THE SAME. In the heat and emotion of a provoked situation, oni Matilah Singapura my have the ability to remain saint, oh, I mean sane. I would say many would have been insane and lose the ability to be scientifically logical in similar case and happening.
What would Matilah likes to say about Woffles Wu's case? The Prosecutor and Judge of the Case were not learned and professional??
Ideally, Woffles should not have give false information. Ideally, Kuan should not have taken the rap for Woffles. Ideally, the Investigator, the Prosecutor, the Judge should have given Singaporeans a better ending of the Case since it did not IDEALLY NOT HAPPENED. How and why now the Case has become the talk of the town?
Because and sadly, IDEAL does not exists. When sanity does not prevail, THERE WILL NEVER BE SAINT around.
patriot
"The law is the law even if it is screwed up law. Remember that", unquote.
Yes, the Law is the Law even if it is pervert law and or perversely exercised.
patriot
We can change that.
Step 1 - beware of what we read, see and hear from MSM.
Step 2 - always be skeptical of what MIW says, read between the lines.
Step 3 - question the policies set in parliament. Who benefits more?
Step 4 - vote wisely, every votes count
Step 5 - see with your eyes and hear with your ears frim now til 2016
Step 6 - non exhaustive, start thinking now
The law is not perfect, neither are we. The law serves only a guide, or should be a guide, to complex human nature.
Yes, the law can be blind but humans are far more perceptive than the law and ultimately, common sense must prevail.
When attacked, if you have the means, strike back in self defense.
Make sure your attacker is dismantled or dismembered if required - just like in the movies.
patriot, redbean et al
I am no saint. I fully understand why Ah Kong did what he did and empathise with him.
Believe it or not I understand emotion and "heat of the moment quite well -- afterall I make money from "manipulating" the consciousness of others ;-)
Let's say, for argument, one believes in the "right to respond in kind, after the fact". Let's also assume for argument's sake, that you think the "law" is fucked and that the bad guy is more protected than you...then that is even more reason to summon up whatever it is you have to remain calm.
So let's say for arguments sake, that you've already decided to ignore the law -- you want to mete out justice on your own.
What it comes down to is this: if you are going to break the law to seek your own "justice", then wouldn't it be wise to learn how to do this properly? For instance, you can "plan" your retaliation carefully.
"Revenge is a dish best savoured cold"
I'll leave your vivid imaginations to ponder the possibilities. And always keep in mind the 11th Commandment: Thou shalt not get caught
I am speaking hypothetically of course...for argument's sake.
Matilah, the error you make is you assume that in retaliation, the victim is seeking justice.
Look, when someone thrust a knife towards your abdomen, are you thinking justice when you stop your attacker with a Bruce lee kick to his face?
If his jaws get dislocated because of your Bruce Lee kick, too bad.
Just don't call that justice when it is purely self defense.
Brain washed! That is what happened when the MSM is controlled by you know who.
The animal kingdom is where you find the finest display of THE LAW OF NATURE. When preyed upon, the natural instinct of animals is to either run away or STRIKE BACK.
Nothing wrong with that! If the law says is wrong, well guess what? Nature disagrees with the law and we, nature designed, will have to disagree with the perverse law too
anon 1048:
There is no error. Ah Kong went after the attacker and whacked him after the fact which means he was seeking some "balance" of the scales.
What Ah Kong did WAS NOT SELF DEFENSE.
When a knife is pointed at your abdomen and you respond rendering your attacker a vegetable at the time of the attack, then that is self defense.
"Self defense" also comes with proviso: You are allowed to use "reasonable force" to stop an attack. If there is weapon used to threaten your life, you can use "more force" than if the thief is just trying to snatch your bag or gold chain.
This is why I encourage people to learn self defense. The training will teach you how to defend yourself and how to strike to suit the situation, to the point it becomes instinctive.
I did not make any reference to ah kong case with my example.
Ah kong brutal retaliation could be interpreted as vicious or beyond self defense.
I think you need to bear in mind that given the opportunity, the gangsters would hurt them as much or more than a broken jaw.
To stop your attacker , you may have to hurt the fellow. That should be taken into consideration.
Matilah, I can assure you that when Ah Kong and his son went after the gangster, there was nothing in their minds about law or retaliation. It was just instinctive reaction, anger and get that bastard and give it back to him.
You trying to say that people in those circumstances would stop, think about the law, about how best to give it back to the gangster? No kidding.
Even sensible and intelligent people, with the benefits of tea and coffee for many days, sitting in their offices, cannot think clearly, will not act correctly.
Got proof? Read the papers.
redbean, if people cannot control their anger, then it is too bad. If there is physical action involves, the consequences are seldom good.
This world is imperfect and so are the people in it. Why do you think that in martial arts training they train you to never fight when your emotional state is angry? Anger fucks up your judgement, that's why.
The fact that "people can't think correctly" is no argument, redbean. I'm amazed that you even tried grasping at that straw making your already weak case even weaker.
Matilah, don't be stupid. If you are going defend yourself, you better harness your anger. Anger is a very powerful energy source and if you don't know how to use it, your lost.
So yes, the right to be ANGRY.
Look at the hulk....it is beautiful when he gets angry haaaa
@anon 1116
You preach to the choir.
I live in a cuntree where violent attacks on innocent people occur several times a day. Over the last 3 years. I've been accosted twice by Aboriginals -- both times by fuckers bigger than I am. Since I'm a short-arse, that is not surprising.
Maybe they see this botak short arse Asian uncle, so they they think they can kuailan. Both times "ask" for money -- or they'll hantam me.
Both times they balls drop and left me alone, after I gave the ultimatum: "Leave me alone and I'll let you live".
I don't suggest you try this unless you are willing to get physical, and go to court with the distinct possibility of ending up in jail.
@anon 1129
You don't know what you are talking about.
Mat Mat Mat, you are talking through your A H again.
"
Both times they balls drop and left me alone, after I gave the ultimatum: "Leave me alone and I'll let you live".
I don't suggest you try this unless you are willing to get physical, and go to court with the distinct possibility of ending up in jail."
You said it, it is self defense, why would you get into trouble with the law?
MAttila Singapura is too human to have animal(natural) instinct. How he relates calmness to spur of the moment is also way beyond me.
Just wonder what and how he would have reacted had the aborigines went ahead to molest him despite his warning. Would be interesting to know.
Anyway, cant help feeling he is in the League of the Justice People, very sane but not too understanding.
patriot
He is short,bald and ugly. I am surprised the aborigines would want to attack him. They should either laugh to death or be terribly distraught just looking at him
@anon 1218
I'll ignore insulting attitude and write it off as a childish idiot who is clueless about the world.
Now to your question:
> why would you get into trouble with the law? <
Because in Aust all street fights eventually end up in court. Like I said the definition of self defense is very narrow, and the term "reasonable force" is open to wide interpretation.
Take the case of a senior citizen some years ago. His home was invaded by a teenager who came in to steal stuff and harass the man and his wife. The old man, fearig for his life and the safety of his wife, went for his shotgun and shot the teen, injuring him. Old man went to jail. Teen kena probation.
Had the old fella been in Texas USA, he would have been acquitted even if the teen died from the shotgun. In Texas there is an 150 yr old law that legalises the use of deadly force for trespasses. Home invasion definitely falls into that realm.
So you'd better know the law in the territory you are in, how to defend yourself, and to accept the possibility of being charged even if you act to defend yourself, your property and your family.
@patriot:
"Being calm" and "acting calm" are different things. Both times my fucking heart was racing.
Fear? Fuck...feel the fear bro!
Going against an opponent bigger than you not the best idea -- if you can you should run away. That is not cowardice, that is being intelligent. Self preservation is self defense.
However in my case I could not run. The guy had grabbed my jacket. Second occasion, the dude looked like he could out run me. Lucky my instinct is to immediately target areas I can strike: knees, groin, solar plexus, kidneys, and any weapons like a pen, plus if I'm going in, I would have to stay either close so he cannot use his reach or jump and weave away out of his reach, but eventually I'll have to go in and drop him or I will be completely fucked up.
You guys take Singapore for granted. Come over here and walk around certain areas during a weekend night. Then you'll be thankful of how damn shiok and safe Singapore is.
Okay lah,must respect the law.Dun argue and always claim injustice.Ah Kong's case is not the only one.Only Pao Kong will know.
Learn something from here.Avoid getting a pretty wife to be on the safer side.Wife too pretty oso dangerous.
Nong nong time ago,my secret Kung Fu master claim that I have got iron fist and not to get into any fight.One punch can break one's rib.
If that 32 years old cheekopek sales executive, LEE Zhi Wee started to say that I punch him after detaining him,thinking that he can secure a lighter sentence for doing so,I can even get jailed.Dun play play.
I only wonder why is the sentence passed before the other 2 accomplices are arrested.Should be able to tell from that 2 whether Ah Kong hurt him after detaining him or he hurt his jaw during the exchange of blows.
Ah Kong has a right to hit back to hopefully immobilize the attacker. In the process, the gangster's jaw broke into two, too bad. It is all part of self defense.
Ah Kong and the Law Enforcers got to learn a thing or two from Agongkia.
Ah Kong was silly to engage lawyer instead of doing what Agongkia suggested. LL plead guilty and ask for leniency, after all kids do that; kneel down to Ah Kong(Kong Ann) tell them You will not do it again. And punish, BUT be lenient, be kind, be magnanimous. Admit your mistake though You acted reflexively, retaliated on the spur. The penalty could be $500 or 1k or a little more. The Lawyer Fee is likely to be much more than that. 'Wan ong'(undue) money.
It is also true as stated by Agongkia, why was the Case concluded when there are 2 more men involved in the fracas on the run? Are all the facts for conviction ascertained in the absence of that two fugitives? Ah Kong got his lawyer to ask or not?
Cannot talk about Ah Kong Case anymore, because it is very hurting to my own feeling. I find it too 'wan ong', however, got to learn from Agongkia, must LL learn to clear it from my mind.
Thank You very very much Agongkia.
patriot
"District Judge Toh Yung Cheong said that after Lee had been subdued, the correct thing to do was to await the police. “Assaulting him at this point was clearly excessive,” said the judge, who noted that Lee’s group had assaulted Ong’s family first."
Assaulting the gangster BEFORE this point was not excessive?
I keep saying over and over -- you cannot hantam the fella AFTER the fact..that's not self defense lah.
However, what you can do is scold him kani nabu chau ji bai which will make him angry and if you keep pressing he is likely to try to punch you.
Then you can apply the "kung fu iron fist" solution and break something on his body, because he clearly tried to attack you, so you had no choice but to defend yourself, rendering sufficiently "reasonable force" to incapacitate the attacker in order for him to stop the assault.
You have to be crafty to use the law to your benefit. Don't feel guilty -- lawyers do it all the time. ;-)
I also say.
Is singapore safe? For how long? When more falalees kill people on the streets.
Stop stirring troubles mati. Shame on your language.
Reasonableness will not dispute with you(MS) on that point. Now what if the AFTER assault had not broken the fellow's jaws?
I think even the court will close an eye.
One or two panda's eyes should do the trick :)
I say folks, by now you should realise that having the ability to be "crafty" when you need to be levels the scales of justice lah.
These life skills are more "art" than "science". If you pay attention to human nature -- especially to your own "monkey mind" -- you can learn a great deal. Your monkey mind is always ticking you. You must learn how to reverse the situation so you can trick your demons. Then perhaps you move closer to the skills of spotting the dangers other people and their actions might pose to you.
My world view. My opinion only ah. This is not "truth". OK?
Redbean,
can you confirm if the following dialogue happens:
Ah Kong: How can you attack my family ?
Gangster: What do you think ?
@Patriot
Thanks for the compliment.
I am harmless and think in good faith,not against anyone and cannot afford to.
Imho,it will attract less debate and suspicion of our system if it is not reported that 2 of the accomplice are still on the run.
If the 2 are to testify,maybe Ah Kong can also landed in a more serious charges and heavier penalty.
Supposing,I say supposing , if a rich towkaykia with possessive disorder,start to challenge any men that admire his wife's beauty and ask kua si mi LC,and started a fight.And his father join in without knowing the facts,you think how many would side with the father being fined.
We have not heard the side of the story on the other party so the statement of the other 2 is important to me,I feel,to lesson suspicion on our jury system.Though I oso got Wan Ong few times by law and pay fines before(Not becos of CharBor).
I like to see Swee Char Bor passing by but I use to Beo only.No one will know that I am admiring those beauties around every time when I do it,becos I BEO only.
If one day suay suay I BEO too long and get caught by a jealous husband and have my jaw broken,you all still think 3 K is expensive for Ah Kong?
This may not be the case of Ah Kong here,I say,supposing only.Many will be more convince if the 2 are around to testify.Good Sunday.
Matilah and your questions. Yes, in all probability the gangsters would ask, 'What do you think?' Gangsters are smart and all thinks alike. With the power of gangsterism, they can do anything.
It was an exception that this Ah Kong and his son were able to take them on. Unfortunately, no one is allowed to take on the gangsters to hurt them. Ah Kong should have pleaded with the gangsters and the latter may show some compassion and let him off. And then Ah Kong should show some gratitude for the kindness of the gangsters.
He should count himself lucky not to be put behind bars by the gangsters.
Hahaha,
no one should ever take Matilah's Advice to provoke the other party in order to have a reason to claim self defense. The penalty could be much more than 3k with jail
patriot
The gangster should have taunted or provoked ah kong more maybe by unzipping and showing what big gun he has got....ah kong upon looking at his big threat may get too excited to think of breaingk his jaw.
Hey folks, I 'm all for gangsters or other bully types to be whacked by good peace-loving citizens who have had enough of being harassed and their families terrorized.
Sometimes a man has to do what a man has to do.
Just be intelligent as opposed to "reactive" and "emotional" about it.
Do you as you must...just don't get caught lah!
patriot
June 24, 2012 9:42 AM said it right.
No one should take Matilah Singapura's advocation unless one is looking for trouble or 'cari mati'.
Matilah terus to listen to him.
The irony is, the judge hurt ah kong more than the gangsters.
Hello folks,
Please don't take anything I write here as "truth" or "advice".
I write opinion, and insults. That's it.
You know what's the biblical way of establishing truth?
Whoever knows the secret can make millions. In fact, worth zillions. :)
Now I damn angry. Just read a report that my hero lost 5 teeth in the fight while his son and daughter in law lost one each.
And he kena fined for breaking the gangster's jaw. Wah lau eh! If I were to lose 5 teeth and my children also kena whacked until lost teeth, I make sure this gangster regreted for his whole life to do that.
And the other two gangsters must be Sinkies. How come still at large?
ah kong lost 5 teeth. can u imagine the force that is required to dilodge a tooth? what a STUPID judge!!! I think judges are living too cosseted lives.
I thought I have learnt a lot about laws. Now I have learnt from the District judge another new trick. If I ever meet an incident like this, I will, with my several decades of martial art training, beat the hell out of the thugs before subduing him.
I have a feeling that the three thugs have some kind of backing. We should all try to trace to the depth of the truth. Judging from the injuries suffered by the victims and the arrogant manners in which they harrassed the family members, they may be members of some trained uniformed groups or related to some big guns in some way. Further, given the efficiency of the police force, why are the other two members not traced?
I think Ah Kong did not get a good lawyer to defend his case. From the report, it appears that he just want to admit guilty and leave the matter behind and his lawyer too happily oblighed.
In a physical tussle, any party can get hurt. No one can say for sure who is right or who is wrong. The court should charge the thug first for initiating the aggression before sentencing the Ah Kong.
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