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2/14/2013
Hri Kumar’s suggestion on defence tax on PRs and foreigners
With so many outcries on the grave disadvantages Sinkies are facing vis a vis PRs and foreigners, finally the plea has landed on the ears of Hri Kumar. And he has proposed to level the playing field a bit more in favour of Sinkies. His suggestions, since Sinkies serve NS, the PRs and foreigners too need to contribute to our defense for enjoying the protection provided by our soldiers. He is talking about some taxes to be levied on the PRs and foreigners.
The principle is right and no one can argue against such logic. What were disturbing were the kind of excuses and protests being made by some of the commentators. This is one of the comments from former NMP Paulin Straughan, ‘Yes, it is important for us to distinguish Singaporeans from non Singaporeans, because citizenship should matter in any country. But in doing so we have to be careful…the tone with which we introduce it is important and also how we differentiate should not stand out from what other countries do so much so that we stand out as a place where if you go there as a foreigner you will be shortchanged.’
Now what is this all about? The underlying assumption is that we need foreigners who are more talented than our locals to come here. True? Look around you and ask yourself how many are real talents? Two, this island is not really that attractive and the foreigners will go somewhere better? Really, go where? Which country is so happy to open their legs to be screwed by foreigners so willingly?
The third point is more hurtful. We must be careful with our tone so as not to offend the foreigners woah, and we must not shortchanged them. Sayang, sayang, please don’t get angry, please come, we need you…. Bull shit! We have been shortchanging our Sinkies for so many years and in so many ways and hurting our citizens in favour of foreigners for too long. Why no one bothers to say anything about shortchanging the Sinkies? Can shortchange the Sinkies but not foreigners?
What do you think?
Something off topic i like to share and hope it will bring a smile to you like it did to me
ReplyDeleteIts a song called
Bugger The Bankers and Politicians
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WSIUf2hD6Io
Enjoy
Bengster
The Proposals by Hri Kumar SHOULD ONLY BE ACCEPTED TO BE APPLIED ON THOSE THAT ARE ALREADY HERE IN SIN AND NOT FOR ANYMORE NEW IMMIGRANTS.
ReplyDeleteTHE PROPOSAL IS A SLY TACTIC THAT SHOULD NOT BE ACCEPTED BY THE CITIZENRY.
patriot
Fuck their feelings!
ReplyDeleteTax them, and be done with it.
Dumb Singaporeans take note:
This does not "level the playing field".
However you may take comfort and enjoy your jollies knowing that the FT who is now your boss or arsed you out of a job because he offers "better value" is being taxed. You as an unemployed soul pay NO TAX. Enjoy whilst you can :-)
Thanks Matilah for listen to me talking cock and AGREEING man! : )
ReplyDeleteOnly stupid and short-term thinking sinkies will accept that.
ReplyDeleteWhat it means is - they pay their share $, you do the duty.. you're the serve while they surf..what can money not buy these days...not only do MIW wants to cheapen the politicians calling as a profession, they now want to cheapen NS men loyalty where money can buy them off their conscience and committment.
Only daft sinkies will accept it.
"The principle is right and no one can argue against such logic."
ReplyDeleteSorry I don't agree. How do you put a $ value to our children potentially laying their lives down for the country.
And especially when its in the form of a "tax", it raises my suspicion no end that it will again still somehow end up in the hands of the chenghu.
Not everyting can be solved by taxes and money payoffs. If it could, could we then buy off our children's NS obligations, were we rich enough?
If you really want to level the playing field, then consider abolishing NS and professionalizing the military.
The foreigners are here and enjoying everything a citizen can and more. More needs to be done to protect Sinkie interests before foreigners take over this country from the Sinkies.
ReplyDelete"The principle is right and no one can argue against such logic."
ReplyDeleteHi RB,
I do not agree that the principle is right! If PRs and FTs can evade serving NS by simply paying a sum of money, can citizens avoid being called up by paying,too?
Our NS men would be relegated to be body guards of rich PRs and FTs while they enjoy their life here.
It is so typical of our MIWs who think money can solve every problem here.
Wah lau eh. Singaporeans so hard to please.
ReplyDeleteSuch a tax would be symbolic. It won't level the field, it won't deter people from coming, the population will still increase, and life will continue whether you and your shallow self-centeredness are happy or not.
Like I said: fuck your feelings -- whether you're local or foreign.
redbean: I only agreed with the tax. As for your cock talk making a mountain out of a mole-hill -- to me that's just unnecessary filler. Padding to make up space. Anyway, your blog -- you write what you like lah!! :-P
Hi guys,
ReplyDeleteThe principle is that Sinkies as citizens must have privileges and not shortchanged. How can foreigners be having same or more advantages than Sinkies.
I also agree with you guys that the sacrifices of NS cannot be monetized. How to return the rights and repay the sacrifices to the Sinkies will have to be worked out carefully to make NS a dignified duty to nation. Yes not everything is about money.
What level playing field...Scholarship for foreigners and "slaVERY" for Singaporeans...
ReplyDeleteWe pay $16,000 a month to this idoit to come up with this suggestion...and Chairman of the GPC committee..
Sorry I don't agree with this MP's idea of an NS-tax on foreigners to be given to NS men. He is just pushing some emotional buttons. He should ask TCJ.
ReplyDeleteThe NS men pay should come from the state. How the state gets money to pay NS men is not relevant.
If we want to level foreigners and Singaporeans, lets do it more comprehensively. For example, foreigners do 2 weeks full time community service each year (not in CCC, RC or medical labs!). And not at his/her own convenient timing.
The principle is equal disruption to careers, and cannot be avoided by paying $.
The best way is paying them to defend our country. Better to start now because when come to 2030 they will have to to that also.
ReplyDeleteBy then the police and solder to total population ratio will not be enough if only base on Singaporean to total population. There will be not enough police and solder to protect the country and society.
Make every foreigner go to IPPT and RT.
ReplyDeleteA healthy workforce is a productive workforce.
Stupid money face MP.
ReplyDeleteCan I pay the tax so that my citizen son be exempted from NS?
ReplyDeleteThe best way to level the playing field.
ReplyDeleteAbolish National Service.
National Service does not serve its original purpose anymore.
There is no country to defend.
PAP says I die it's my business.
So I also say PAP and Singapore die it's your business.
Let the Millionaire Ministers defend their own multi million dollar bungalows by themselves.
Here we go again.
ReplyDeleteIf PRs and foreigners can pay to avoid doing NS, would this rule be relaxed later to favour richer Singaporeans asking to do likewise? I am sure the rich will raise a hue and cry foul, then some more wayangs will be staged in Parliament to relax the rules, because rich people must not run away. What will this lead to?
If it is a token tax being suggested, just to placate NSmen and parents, definitely not a good idea.
dun forget another group of ppl who need to pay this tax... new citizens who nvr serve NS. for eg: hri kumar's esteemed parliamentary colleague - Dr Janil Puthucheary...
ReplyDeleteHri is an idiot. Trying to shift the responsibility of MINDEF and PAP to foreigners.
ReplyDeleteInjured in NS? Please go ask foreigners for support. That's what Hri is proposing.
This is not new. It was suggest by Kenneth Jeyaretnam. Why does this bloke not acknowledge that ?
ReplyDeleteHe voted for 6.9. Bloke-ox.
Nabeh. You're hostility and penchant for complaining about everything and nothing must be unique to Singapore lah.
ReplyDeleteLet's for the sake of argument agree than NS is legalised kidnapping or slavery or something like that. But it is also LEGAL and males are required to serve.
To be as fair as fair can be, how about this: New Citizens will serve NS but in non-military positions where they will not be issueed with weapons. e.g. police ok, but no guns. I don't think it is a good idea to issue foreigners with government owned weapons.
I don't see why the lot of them can't be conscripted into Civil Defence, say one weekend per month plus 2 major exercises per year. Oh yeah, they have to pass IPPT or kena "remedial fitness training" just like everyone else -- so those Ah Pui's who've been eating too much nasi padang and drinking Tiger also have to pull their weight (lame pun intended).
This doesn't negaste the tax however. They still pay the tax. This is only new citizens, maybe PR's.
BTW some foreign workers have been taxed for years: The Maid Levy. So the mention of tax is not really a new idea.
You hostile fuckers still got problem meh?
Jibai lah!
Sigh... is this the best that my highly-paid MP can come up with? I am sorely disappointed.
ReplyDeleteWhy can a PR foreigner can an option while Singgies have no choice?
Anyway I have long blogged that Singaporeans do NOT have choice - in the nutshell, you are basically a surf with no voice, no rights and no choice.
I can't seem to find a post I had written about the one thing Singaporeans often do not have vs another citizen from a developed country - that is a CHOICE.
Have fun and happy Chinese new year.
Kaffein
What MIWs know is dollars and cents. NS is about defending country not to be bought, but Singapore is a corporation. (Setting up funds need another organization so more cronies néeded, more brilliant ideas from the MIWs)
ReplyDeleteIf Singapore as a country do not value NS it should be abolished but not to be bought according to this smart alec (trying to score political point that he cares for Singaporean, but vote for the white paper)
This MP is a complete moron. Why not suggest giving every NS men a piece of COE to recognise them and shut their mouths off? Set up a trust fund for what? For someone to gamble away the monies?
ReplyDeleteNS or no NS is a choice, it should never be made mandatory in the first place and should be opened to women and PRs. It is not so hard to operate an automatic machine gun or a drone fighter plane. Simple training will do and we are not dealing with weapons from stone age.
Democratic means having a choice but this shitty place simply provided no choice for the average person but lots of choices for the rich.
Better still, they should just enlist loads of pretty foreign girls for NS and many guys would sign up for NS voluntarily including matilah. THis will also deter foreign invasion since they mostly likely be killing their own kind.
ReplyDeleteTHis will also improve fertility rate - no need to import so many 'foreigners'.
ReplyDeleteHi rb,
ReplyDeleteThis is another incontrovertible proof that the current regime is inept, out of touch and completely money-grubbers.
See, they are running out of ideas. Whatever they come up with is all about money.
When there's a problem (created by them in the first place), their idea of a solution is to tax. Nothing new here.
Instead of coming with real solutions, money-grubbers always have have more ways of taking money. Call it by any name, it is still a tax. Tax is not an issue per se, it is the purpose and intent. In this case, the problem solving intent and objectives are really shallow and devoid of social sense.
PRs and foreigners are now paying 5 to 10% stamp duties on purchase of their first property - see 7th cooling measures of Jan 2013. This NS duty is just another source of raising money without dealing with the real underlying issue.
I have yet to see a real solution from them all these years. Perhaps, the real solutions are the hard truths about their unsustainable platform.
faber
Very simple bro, just ask the public "what do you think"
DeleteThen sit back and have all the opinions suggestions and later try to implement them with bit of modifications and said there you have it.
Still draw their million dollars salaries
These days people already do unmanned mode but the shitty rulers still want to do it the retro way. They are just so stone age.
ReplyDeleteI suggest that they think about developing unmanned weapons industry here. I reckon it a big lucrative market. No need big numbers of high low skilled foreigners here.
ReplyDeletePretty sure the Stone Age errrmm rocked more. The current govt has boulders for brains.
ReplyDelete"Paulin Straughan" - that name sounds completely german to me. of cos she will say cannot short change foreigners lah.
ReplyDeleteSTForum Feb 15
ReplyDelete[Settle differences for the sake of S'pore football]
"IT IS a sad day for local soccer to see the Football Association of S'pore clashing with our favourite footballing son Fandi Ahmad ("Soccer war of words"; yesterday).
What is more alarming is the possibility of Fandi's talented sons Irfan and Ikhsan not representing the Lions one day.
It would be a slap in the face of S'pore football if they represented South Africa instead.
David Tan Kok Kheng"
http://www.straitstimes.com/premium/forum-letters/story/settle-differences-the-sake-singapore-football-20130215
TR Emeritus
ReplyDelete[Did you notice S’pore is not congested even after CNY?]
"It was amazing these last 2 days all the streets were clear after the CNY holidays, even after everyone is back at work.
There was no congestion in the MRT.
Take a guess why!
1 million PRCs went back for their CNY holidays.
You don’t have to be a rocket scientist to understand this phenomenon."
http://www.tremeritus.com/2013/02/14/did-you-notice-spore-is-not-congested-even-after-cny/
Silly Sinkies
ReplyDeleteIf you really believe that foreigners are ruining your lives, let's just cancel all work permits and PR, and see what is left. Pick up your own garbage, close all the restaurants, clean your own flats, raise your own children, and forget those MNC manager jobs you covet so highly.
PR's already pay the same taxes as Singaporeans for less services and no guarantee of right to stay. If you think the principle of pricing each item separately makes sense, then I want a discount for medical, passport, housing, topups, and all the other things I pay for but don't get.
@anon 1209
ReplyDeleteI think you need to take a brain enema to get rid of the detritus which is obviously confusing you.
Although there are anti-PR/ FT sentiments in the community (you only need to read this blog to get a taste) -- that can't be helped, people are tribal -- tomorrow's protest at Hong Lim is not targeted to the foreign "invaders" but to the government who rammed thru legislation.
Such a serious issue really needs more input from the people, perhaps a cooling off period, public forums etc. -- let the people express how they feel before legislating.
Of course the people feel SLIGHTED. They've every right to be pissed off and angry at their government, which is actually part of themselves as a collective.
It is important, especially those under 40 yrs old, to attend tomorrow and if possible participate pro-actively. But remain peaceful, although not necessarily calm.
Most Singaporeans (especially the young ones -- as clever and highly educated as they are) do not know, or understand or have participated in; experienced CIVIL DISOBEDIENCE and mass protest.
Most Singaporeans are still UNAWARE that it is a constitutional right to be able to ASSEMBLE PEACEFULLY to air one's grievances about the government.
Singaporeans MUST as some point, reclaim this right and force the governments feet to the fire to adhere to the constitution.
I support the increase of population to even beyond 6.9 million. However I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT SUPPORT THE GOVERNMENT who unilaterally rams through sensitive widely-affecting legislation simply because they have the numbers in the house, and make the lame argument: "well the people gave us a mandate". Bullshit. Such a serious matter, especially when most people are already pissed off with their current policies.
Which is why I give this protest a hearty thumbs up, and wish them all the best -- even though I take the opposite view.
A robust democracy is messy, loud, chaotic, often wrong, but tolerant. It should be loud, it should be passionate, slinging insults is part of it, so is libel and slander -- this is all speech and when people get hot, so will their speech. That 's the crucible where wild ideas come from. There's always shouting and screaming.
Logic and reason come after emotions have calmed down, but we ARE EMOTION-DRIVEN ANIMALS so expect hostility. If it doesn't get physical, anything goes as far as speech is concerned.
Every society and culture should be an on-going social experiment. However it is not JUST the governments prerogative to call the shots. Balls to them.
The people get the government they deserve. Which is yet another reason to protest. "The Government" is a minority sub-set of "The People", they are still part of The People but happen to have been voluntarily "trusted" with the absolute powers of The State.
If You, The People don't control and limit that "absolute power" then what is there to stop the small sub-set of The People known as The Government from abusing that power?
Still apathetic?
Got constitution?
@anon 538:
ReplyDeleteKani nah chao goondo!
I would have served anyway lah. I was already going to sign on.
Although I am anti-conscription (forced enlistment), I am very much pro-military (voluntary enlistment), especially a well-armed and trained citizen's militia. (no need for standing army).
>> they should just enlist loads of pretty foreign girls for NS
If you have the audacity to suggest the use of other peoples daughters for the sexual gratification of NS guys, why not you show some "good faith" by sending your mother and sister to blow the troops?
I think that's a fair request.
The White Paper was passed in Parliament by as good a method as 'lom chiam pah'. The 77 won and 13 lost. So they want to carry it out.
ReplyDeleteIs the PAP incapable of solving problems using any other method except throwing money or collecting fines?
ReplyDeleteThis kind of problem solving does not require highly talented million dollar ministers.
when in the post did I mentioned 'for the sexual gratification of NS guys'? just because you are the victim of child sex abuse does not mean you can talk without any fact. no wonder you want to treat your own country as a hotel not a home. you should go and see a therapist instead of spending time here.
ReplyDelete@anon 12:09
ReplyDeleteif you think this 6.9mil plan only affects singaporeans.. u better think again...
another 1.6mil ppl, of which minimally half mil will be PMETs who also wants to buy a car, who also works in the CBD like u, who also goes to which ever joint you are hanging out in.. the roads will be worse than today, the pub which u frequent in will be full and lets not even mention about the daily taxi situation which u depend on to go home every evening...
if i have to pick up my own trash, serve my own food, clean my own house and raise my own children to kick fucking ungrateful PRs like you out, guess what?
so be it. we WONT die.
singaporeans are very marginalised, if they want a better pay, they have to go far away like europe, us or oz. malaysians just need to cross the border to get a better pay, everyday can even go back hometown. pig party are pro malaysians and anti singaporeans. no wonder so many mps are ex malaysians.
ReplyDeleteThe 7 million population white paper outsiders' influx will definitely put the enlistment policy under very intense scrutiny and debate.
ReplyDeleteCan we citizens pay the defence tax and be exempted from enlistment.
NO WHAT!
Quite a large proportion of the immigrant kids, a third of them liable for NS choose not to serve.
They can what!
Yes they have a choice just give up the red IC.
Just now on TV defence minister say these people should not be given their PR also.
No punishment anyway for these lucky people who are not citizens hence not subjected to Enlistment Act unlike local.
If this is not double standards then what is ?
Please, they can still can work with just an employment pass/wprker permit, dun need PR right?
@anon 514:
ReplyDeleteWow. You won't let up will you? Something about me you no like mistuh?
You no like me cum your cuntree fuck gur (ruv me rong time), make $ spend $, hire FT for my biz-net and enjoy plenty plenty like HOTEL?
There, there...with such neurotic hatred (to the point where you have to even suggest "child abuse") -- guess who probably needs therapy more?
Jealous much?
@anon1241:
ReplyDeleteThis mode of PAP thinking that the only way to get people to "do as the master says" is threaten punishment was flawed from the beginning.
The you couple that thinking to a policy that never should be -- conscription, add to that the messiness of "obligations" of new citzens, and you get an unholy sewer of shit of irreconcilable contradictions -- i.e. a situation you can't use logic or reason to solve, so you, as an over-paid govt minister might as well just decide suka suka or as one blogger suggested "lom chiam pas" (for non-Singlish foreigners: rock, paper, scissors).
Government logic.
@Matilah_Singapurah:
ReplyDeleteYou managed to avoid all the points I made - I really don't care waht the population white paper said, this is about taxing foreigners in lieu of NS.
There is only one way to prove the point that Singapore depends on foreign workers (of all flavours - PR, WP, PMETS, ad nauseum). Stop allowing anyone not born here (oh sorry, your wife has to leave) to stay.
Singapore exists as a thin layer of Western technology and forced compliance. Remove the guys actually running things on the ground, and your infrastructure will be gone in a month. You can barely keep the trains running as it is. Instead of maintaining buildings, you tear them down after 10-15 years.
You still can't figure out the difference between hating others and taking responsibility for your own condition. You have allowed a single party state for 50+ years. You are just starting to realize that the interests of the elite do not coincide with yours.
As a tax paying resident in this country, I have to post anonomously because I have no rights or representation.
The status of PR is a joke - it is not permananent, so don't get confused about equality.
@anon 617
ReplyDeleteI don't know what you're arguing about.
>> I really don't care waht the population white paper said, this is about taxing foreigners in lieu of NS.
I don't care a fart about the white paper too. I have already stated that the tax on foreigners/PR's etc in lieu of NS is SYMBOLIC -- you know, like the rote reciting of a pledge no one believes in ;-)
>> You still can't figure out the difference between hating others and taking responsibility for your own condition. You have allowed a single party state for 50+ years. You are just starting to realize that the interests of the elite do not coincide with yours
You obviously don't know who I am ;-). I don't support the PAP govt, I make my own way in life...and I treat Singapore as HOTEL, to be a base where I can do as I please, come and go on my whim alone. Yes, I was born in Hougang, I hold a pink NRIC, served NS...and I still say "FUCK THE GOVERNMET". I don't give a shit if the PAP have been in for 50 years -- I'm not to blame for that, because as long as I can make money and pay low taxes, get drunk and have wild sex with multiple females, I don't care who the fuck runs the bloody cuntree -- which to me is a HOTEL
>> As a tax paying resident in this country, I have to post anonomously because I have no rights or representation.
Well, well...the "tax payer" argument. I also pay tax. Do I care if I have "representation"? Nope. To me a tax is simply "a cost of doing business" in the world's most rocking place to do business.
Rights? Don't expect the government to give you rights. A government can only TAKE AWAY rights. You think you have a right, then it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to claim that right and exercise it.
Got self-reliance?