8/09/2014

CPF – An asset or a liability to YOU?




CPF is our life savings, how can it be a liability? By 55 we should all be happily getting it out from our CPF accounts for our retirement. Ok, the rules have changed, by 65 we should be happy, late than never.
The rude shock to CPF members, by 55 they are told that they ‘owe’ the CPF or the govt $155,000 in the Retiremment Account and $43,500 in the Medisave Account. Yes, you need to let the CPF or govt have these sums of money like you owe them. If you don’t have enough in your CPF savings, or lesser than these sums in your CPF, you cannot take out your savings. But the CPF would be so kind to let you have $5,000.  Or you can pledge your property to the CPF for half of the total sum of the total sum of $198,500, or is it half of the $155,000, with the CPF.

Put it whatever you like, isn’t this a liability, a huge sum of money that you now ‘owe’ to the CPF?  Yes or No? By 55, many would find the CPF a liability instead of an asset in away.

This must be another Uniquely Singapore thing. You can owe the govt or a savings scheme money when you are supposed to be taking out your savings to live your golden years. And many Singaporeans are finding this damn stressful.

Oh, not to forget, if you sell your property bought using your CPF savings, you have to return the sum borrowed plus the equivalent of interests that the money should have earned over the same period to your CPF account even if you are retired, in your 80s or 90s or 120s. It is not that after the withdrawal age kicks in, whatever money you took out for the purchase of properties is none of the CPF business. All these open ended contributions to the CPF regardless of age must be driving many people crazy, except the people making these rules and collecting the money.

Tiok boh?

Kopi Level - Green

32 comments:

Anonymous said...

Hi RB, speedwing here. Totally confusing to an outsider. Maybe you can explain over a cuppa kopi O when we meet at HLP @ 2.00 pm today?

agongkia said...


My Towkay is selling his pigeon hole as he is 55,thinking he can have some money to pay back to bank loan and Ah Long,be free from debt.He now learn that he will be a slave till he die as he cannot withdraw the money at 55.
He is angry with me when I say its a tax and welfare paid by employer like him.
How come so many people still dream about CPF ?
Matilah where are you?

Anonymous said...

RB, if you are self employed like sole proprietor or partnership etc there is also a cpf tax on you. It's looking more like a liability to me now though I have retired and work part time. If don't pay up, court action will be taken.

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

Hi Speedwing, I will be there only at 4pm.

Any self employed with a licence to renew will have to keep paying into the Medisave no matter how old you are.

Anonymous said...

Assuming one start work at average age 23 ( most gals graduate from poly and uni aged 19 and 22/ 23 respectively and guys 2 years later), until 65, that is 42 years.

Many work during holidays between 16 to 24.

So cpf contribution could have started earlier.

Even longest government treasury bills or bonds in US and many parts of the world are NOT MORE THAN 30 years bought and invested VOLUNTARILY.

Even when final " withdrawal " or "redemption" is allowed, it is given in bits and pieces over another 20 to 30 years.

So the first 10-15 years withdrawal from 65 are only for interest?

Effectively, cpf contribution is locked up more than 50 years from start of contribution?

In history, which government bonds issuer can borrow $$$$$ at 2.5% interest rate over more than half a century?

Ask any ANG MO OR knowledgeable bond traders or fund managers got such thing in the whole world since WWI, 1914, 100 years ago?

If not, then what's happening?

Is it CPF HOLDERS' $$$$$ OR somebody's else money?

If they are the former, what are the loan terms?

50 year bond? 60 year? 70 year?

Would ANYONE voluntarily loan money @2.5% for a 50 or 60 year bond and cannot be traded or having any early redemption?

This whole official explanation is to put it gently "hilarious" and beyond "disbelief" ?

Would BOTAK himself invest all his savings in a 50 year bond that is 100% illiquid @2.5% interest and in the end after more than 50 years redemption is in small installments over next 20 to 30 years? All these buggers working on premise of 150 year human life span? Otherwise what is all these 50 years lock up and after that another 20 to 30 years repayments in bits and pieces? How LONG do normal folks need to survive to get their hands on their blood, sweat and tears retirement, golden years and coffins $$$$$?

Anonymous said...

The CPF is just like National Service.
These are PAP created institutions that should be abolished.

CPF and NS reduces the true cost of capital and labour.
- allowing and subsidizing the PAP government to anyhow spend and invest.

Example
-------------
If we paid our NS men the real market value for their salaries, do you think our Minister of Defence will have so much money to buy F-35?

If our NS men were paid their real salaries ... just think about the boost to our economy with all that extra spending power.
- and the poorer Singaporean families would not have to beg PAP MPs for welfare.

If CPF was abolished.
Does anybody think that Temasek & GIC will have so much money to invest and maybe lose?

Anonymous said...

PAP Polanpas like agongkia and matilah love doing national service and paying taxes. Like their masters, they enrich themselves by exploiting others. These elites loves money more than anything else. They are the rich people that get richer by exploiting others and any loopholes by the state administrators.And some loopholes are created for exploitations.

Anonymous said...

"All these open ended contributions to the CPF regardless of age must be driving many people crazy,..."
RB

But did the majority become crazy enough to vote opposition in GE 2011, when PAP govt was even worse than PAP govt now?

No, tio bo?

So what are the chances majority will become crazy in 2016 to vote opposition, u tell me lah?

If I were PM Lee, as long as they did not vote opposition, let them be crazy lah.

Anonymous said...

Is there something PAP know or do, and which Sinkies like RB and us do not know, that make at least 60% vote PAP every election?

Anonymous said...

10.55 I do know cause 60% are daft

Anonymous said...

PAP - An asset or a liability to YOU?

Let's not mince words.
Let's get right to the root of the problem.

Anonymous said...

Rb:// Oh, not to forget, if you sell your property bought using your CPF savings, you have to return the sum borrowed plus the equivalent of interests that the money should have earned over the same period to your CPF account even if you are retired, in your 80s or 90s or 120s. //


Rb, mb YEW still not paying enough attention?

Or YEW dun understand INGRISH?

CPF means " CASH PRIOR FUNERAL "?

So YEW get it FINALLY?

OLDIES can get their C(ash) P(rior) F(uneral) just before the undertaker received the telephone calls from their bereaved family members?

At least one last and ONLY chance to smell the new stack of cash notes with the last breathe in their death beds before their wailing and weeping family members?

Anonymous said...

I think it all boils down to the freedom of choice.
Freedom means making choices.
Even if it's the wrong choice.

Under s PAP government, there is no choice.
Everything is legislated, controlled or compulsory.

And nobody dares to change anything.
Including this current generation of PAPigs.
One entire nation of Singaporeans.
Running on autopilot.
Wake up.
LKY is in no condition to undo his policies anymore.

Anonymous said...

Rb, just tell YEW some people today might have other family gatherings especially those leaving for overseas for good and thus a farewell gathering for a long time to come.

This HLP ("Horrendous Leedership Protest") CC ( "Covert Community" ) cafeteria lim kopi meet up might be unfortunately given a miss by some due to other prearranged family gatherings.

However, many would likely give moral support to the bros and sisters and wishing everybody who can attend a happy and fruitful gathering.

In whatever little ways we do, whether showing face, blogging, buying each other kopi, spending time to post comments, encouraging and egging each other on in this arguably long and arduous journey to reclaim our rightful place and what rightfully belongs to us, we need and should stand shoulder to shoulder in united solidarity in our common quest to make this place a sustainable and bearable home base for our future generations.

When the leedership has lost the way and sold their souls, the sheeple need not blindly follow the soulless and lost shepherd into the desert and wilderness. There will rise another shepherd eventually to lead the sheeple to green and sustainable pastures. For now, the sheeple shall abandon the soulless and lost shepherd and stay united to achieve our common quest for the well being and survival of our future generations.

9 Aug 2014 shall be the day to mark the "Re-Birth" of the " SINKIES SINKIELAND " at HLP ( "HORRENDOUS LEEDERSHIP PROTEST").

HAPPY RB (RE-BIRTH) DAY!

Anonymous said...

CPF has become our major liability when we grow old. It has failed as a retirement saving plan. I hate it when they insist on calling it pension plan. PAP getting good at word play and bad at policies implementation. But if the policies are flawed - can't expect much. all the ugliness will surface a few years after implementation. we are witness it now.

Matilah_Singapura said...

CPF is used as a tool of manipulation.

It is BOTH an asset or a liability to you, DEPENDING ON THE GOVERNMENT'S SAY SO.

Forget it lah. You will never be able to control the money "allegedly" yours in the CPF. And the govt and people know this. The loud complainers are mostly uncles in their 50's who bang balls cannot get their money to spend on banging young pussy.

Don't get me wrong. I whole heartedly support the state letting the uncles have the money to dispose of in any fucking way they like -- even if it means they are broke at the end.

Anyway, the govt is just practicing The Golden Rule:

He who ha the Gold makes the Rules. Once you've given up your gold to the govt. you don't have "power" anymore.

Write it off lah. The money you gave to CPF is "sunk". You are not alone: everyone also kena.

Anonymous said...

Vote out PAP first.
Otherwise CPF will never be open for discussion or changes or withdrawals.

Anonymous said...

Chinese and most Oriental Cultures thrive on 兴国旺家, prosper the Nation to lead happy living.
In Sin now, it is 卖(败)国毁家, selling off national assets and breaking up families. Family togetherness suffered since the people were resettled into public housings. Now the children choose not to live with parents whereas male siblings in the Past mostly stayed together even if they were married.
Sinkies have lost all their tradition and custom within a few decades of self rule by locals. Roots are all rotten and yet they claim to have improved leaps and bounds.

Most kids and some adults may enjoy this National Day, however, most breadwinners are caught in much worry and despair facing the Future. Most are lost and left in the Lurch, few are certain of their future.

Nevertheless, let's celebrate while we have some mood for it, for what comes next year is hard to tell.

Rb is giving coffee treat at HLP today and this too is kind of celebration. Happy gathering.

Anonymous said...

Y u still masturbating over old fart kuan yew pekkim?

hormat senjata hormat

Huat ah... with papigs in control

Anonymous said...

Anon 2.09. // Rb is giving coffee treat at HLP today //

Actually eventually can make the lim kopi session into a weekly Saturday/ Sunday morning or late afternoon affair? Some weekdays night are also possible alternative timings?

Good idea?

Can lim kopi, share each other's concerns and discuss issues confronting SINKIELAND?

Anonymous said...

huat ah .... i saw old fart kuan yew

i so elated .... my cpf is not pekkim yet

it called pekkim-in-kinds

huat ah .... u dafts, leemember to vote for papigs

because your cpf will still be safe

otherwise ... u be leegreting if alternative parties are the majority

huat ah .....

Anonymous said...

Went to HLP today, but no kopi. The kopi shop was closed. RB was nowhere to be found.

Anonymous said...

The kopi shop was closed. RB was nowhere to be found.
Anon 10:07 pm

Since kopi shop was closed, cannot blame RB lah. He cannot fulfil his promise even if he wanted to, tio bo?

Just like since the opposition is not ready to be govt, 60% cannot vote opposition even if they wanted to.

Anonymous said...

Today holiday mah.
Come back tomorrow and curse PAP again lah!

Anonymous said...

Compared to the celebration last night at the Marina Bay, the gathering at HLP was miserable. Not many people there, maybe 200 - 300 at most. Well, I guess people must be getting tired of shouting into the wind with no one listening. Lost hope and resign to the fact that voicing your discontent is useless when no one listen. If the attendance at HLP yesterday was an indication of happiness in Singapore, then the Singaporeans must be the happiest people. The event at Marina Bay was colourful, spectacular and there was happiness everywhere. I guess 2016 will show not just a 60/40 split but maybe a 75/25 split in favour of the PAP. Maybe that is a good thing? The CPF issue will become the norm and accepted by all, maybe with a few grumble here and there, but at the end, it will be accepted. A few angpows here and there just before next GE will sweeten the bitterness and all will be forgotten and forgiven. That is the Singapore way.

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

I was there at 3.45 and stayed on till 4.30 before moving away. Never see Speedwing. Met a few. I was wearing a dark blue T with a white cap.

I can't recognise any of you but you should be able to recognise me. When walking around, a couple called out to me as well.

Kopi stall was closed but still got cold kopi and other drinks from the vending machine.

Maybe we do it again on 23 Aug. Now very sure even if the kopi stall is closed, there is a vending machine for cold kopi there. No problem.

Anonymous said...

Hi RB, speedwing here. I was there from 3.50 pm to 5.00 pm. Went the the kopi place found the place shut. I listened to 6 speakers and then left.

Anonymous said...

PM LHL - An assest or a liability to YOU?

31st May 2014
-------------
PM Lee says okay to import food from radioactive contaminated Fukushima, Japan

8 August 2014
------------------
Japan Prepares To Release Thousands Of Tons Of Fukushima Groundwater Into The Pacific

TEPCO has admitted in a new report that more nuclear fuel had melted at the Fukushima nuclear reactor than previously stated.

http://news.asiaone.com/news/singapore/singapore-lifts-import-restrictions-japanese-food-products

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/english/news/20140807_09.html

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-08-06/three-years-later-japan-finally-tells-truth-more-fuel-melted-fukushima

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

Hi Speed, I was trying to look out for you, but no way for me to recognise you. There was an Indian gentleman who looked foreigner, a few Chinese gentlemen, a couple.

Thought you would be able to recognise me. Maybe the cap that I put on. I had my camera on my neck as well. I was in dark blue T and in faded jeans. Make any impression?

Anonymous said...

Hi RB, maybe next time we will make better contact. My good Singaporean better half was with me, so maybe the " couple " was us. I tried to find you but alas could not recognise you.

I thought the speakers were not too eloquent enough. More forceful speakers should bring in a better crowd. Credit to the speakers yesterday, after all, they were just ordinary Singaporeans, not the highly paid, well groomed, super talents from the other side. I give them full credit.

Anonymous said...

Next time.
Maybe try hanging a Guy Fawkes mask around your necks.
Or maybe a red rose in the right shirt pocket.

Chua Chin Leng aka redbean said...

Good suggestion.

Oh the couple. They looked so Singaporean. I was trying to look out for someone who looked more like Europeans in dressing, and perhaps older.

Well, we will trying to make it the next time if you are still here, 23 Aug.